• wheezy@lemmy.ml
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    3 days ago

    I really would love to understand where this idea that “Marxist Leninist = Putin supporter”

    Marxist Leninist (myself included) hate Putin. Putin is literally the embodiment of western neoliberalism in post Soviet Russia. He was literally installed and supported by western aligned oligarchs and capitalist within Russia.

    I really am curious where you get this idea. I’d love receipts. I really hope it’s not just “MLs criticize NATO”. I really really hope it’s not just a binary view of the world like that. I swear people view the world like it’s a football match.

    Do you think Russia is still run by MLs?

      • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
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        3 days ago

        Why would we not criticize Putin? He’s a reactionary capitalist. Our critique of Putin isn’t that he’s some supernatural evil like liberal analysis often circles back to, but instead based on his actual, material position. Pushing back on liberal analysis doesn’t mean Putin is “our guy” or anything of the sort. First and foremost, we oppose the imperialist system headed by the US, and NATO which exists to protect it.

        Any critical support for Russia extends to their right to self-determination from NATO encirclement, and their opposition to western imperialism, not to their reactionary, bourgeois society nor Putin at the top. The dissolution of the Soviet Union was a tremendous human tragedy, one that directly led to the current war today.

    • Fizz@lemmy.nz
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      3 days ago

      Don’t play dumb to try and waste my time. You know exactly where it comes from and you’re on the ML instance so your feed is full of pro russia shit.

      • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
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        3 days ago

        Marxist-Leninists despise NATO, for the genocidal terror inflicted by its member-states around the world and its position as a coalition of imperialist powers. Marxist-Leninists also despise Putin and United Russia, and believe socialism to be a necessity for Russia in the future that the nationalists will not accept willingly.

        The major difference is that Marxists are materialists. We don’t believe Putin is some embodiment of supernatural evil trying to eat babies and conquer the world, we seek materialist explanations for the conditions and analyze them dialectically. This puts our analysis at odds with those who see the world similarly to Marvel movies, as conflict between the forces of good and evil.

        • BanMeFromPosting@lemmy.mlBanned from community
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          3 days ago

          Marxist-Leninists despise NATO, for the genocidal terror inflicted by its member-states around the world and its position as a coalition of imperialist powers

          Well… That, and the fact that it is a nazi institution full of nazis that put nazis back into power in West germany 2

          Not that the history of an institution condems it completely, but it certainly does not help when it continues to be a nazi institution

          • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
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            3 days ago

            Yep, just trying to keep it basic in this environment. There’s a mountain of depth we could go to, but for many people here this may be their first time hearing actual opposition to NATO as an institution, with no knowledge of Marxism beyond “capitalism bad, communism good.” You gotta meet people where they are at, without committing tailist errors by blocking further growth.

            • BanMeFromPosting@lemmy.mlBanned from community
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              3 days ago

              For sure. I just feel like “it was full of nazis from its’ inception” is a good starting point - If there are good sources backing the claim. Most people understand that “nazi = bad” so it’s a great way to make them think deeper about NATO because most westerners are of the notion that “NATO = good”

              • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
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                3 days ago

                Yep, linking the Wikipedia page for Adolf Heusinger can be helpful. At the same time, liberals tend to compartmentalize that to the past and focus instead on the present, like history is a series of snapshots. This is the limit of metaphysical analysis at the heart of liberalism. The entrypoint should often instead be how NATO is actively bad today. Then you can connect it historically as supporting evidence, and use this to develop rudimentary historical materialist analysis.

      • wheezy@lemmy.ml
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        3 days ago

        So you have no examples? Like, you don’t even have to link it. You can literally just tell me an example. I’m just asking for the bare minimum here mate.

        My feed is full of Linux memes and pro Palestine posts. I’m not the charactercher you’ve constructed in your head.