The Last Jedi sucks, but not for the reasons right-wing chuds complained about. The premise of the entire chase rests on a bunch of Macguffin’s (they can suddenly track ships through hyperspace, fuel is an issue for the first time ever, no one can escape except when they can), the Canto Bight sequence is pointless and contrived, the light-speed kamikaze blows a plot hole in basically every other movie, and Poe should have been executed for mutiny.
Structurally, I get what Johnson was doing; everyone complained that The Force Awakens was a beat for beat retelling of A New Hope, so he basically inverted the plot structure of The Empire Strikes Back. It’s a fun idea, but his desire to end on a Hoth sequence ruined what could have been a perfect ending. I was having problems with that movie, but after Snoke gets murdered, Rey and Ben have one of the best lightsaber fights in Star Wars history, and Ben asks her to join him, I was expecting the credits to roll, and I was ready to leave on one of the greatest cliffhangers in movie history. But then there’s another 30 minutes of movie, and while the Luke stuff is cool, it mostly just drags on.
It’s also clear that Johnson wasn’t just inverting plot structure, but Star Wars norms. Everything that is established is questioned and turned on it’s head. The problem is, by the end of the film, it’s all thrown out and the status quo is hastily reestablished with little justification. What’s the lesson from Canto Bight and DJ? “Rebellion? Empire? Two sides of the same coin for the weapons dealers. The real battle is between the haves and have-nots.” How does the movie end? “Get on the princess’ space ship, we’re not done fighting the Empire!” The entire Rey/Luke/Ben aspect of the film? “Light? Dark? Jedi? Sith? They’re just artificial constructs. Let them die. Burn the temple.” How does the movie end? “Don’t worry, Rey didn’t join the Dark Side and she’s got all the magic Jedi books!”
Anyway, there’s also a lot of stuff I like (the Rey/Luke scenes are excellent), and it’s bad in an interesting way, which makes it better than the rest of the trilogy by default. I guess this is more of a small essay than a hot take, but TL;DR: chuds think The Last Jedi sucks because of wokeness, but it actually suckes for lot of structural, thematic, and plot weaknesses.
I mean, there is a lot of good stuff in there, and I genuinely love Rian Johnson. I think the Knives Out movies are the best thing to happen to the mystery genre in decades, and Poker Face is the second best. And honestly, most of my problems with TLJ are because of Johnson made interesting choices, which is better than Abrahams making a shot-for-shot remake of A New Hope or whatever the hell he was trying to do with Rise of Skywalker.
Yeah I feel like I saw a different movie than everyone else with that one. I think everyone got on their respective hills willing to die based on the marketing, and no one was willing to change their opinions.
TLJ was actually the most misogynistic of all of the Star Wars movies. It was boring and unoriginal. It fails at everything related to action and adventure. Everything that happened in it was just stuff from ESB and RoTJ thrown into a blender with the point of those plotlines removed. It didn’t change anything about Star Wars, it just removed a bunch of things set up in the previous movie and added nothing to replaced it.
I was having problems with that movie, but after Snoke gets murdered, Rey and Ben have one of the best lightsaber fights in Star Wars history
Yeah after the big bad is killed, they fight some unnamed guards. That’s kinda the problem with TLJ in a nutshell, by trying to do everything backwards it removes the point of everything. Normally in an action movie they might fight some guards before facing the big bad to build up some tension. But in TLJ it’s just stuff that looks cool but there’s no point to it. There’s no tension when the main characters are fighting unnamed dudes. Who even were those guys?
Rian Johnson doesn’t understand action movies. Sure he made Looper, but that was basically the same plot as Terminator 2, except gangsters instead of robots, and had way less action. He just didn’t know how to make an action movie, but they gave him free reign on the middle movie of a trilogy.
TLJ was actually the most misogynistic of all of the Star Wars movies.
Curious to know why you feel that way. I’ve heard chuds complain that it was too feminist, but I’ve never heard anyone claim it was misogynistic.
Yeah after the big bad is killed, they fight some unnamed guards.
Yeah, I didn’t care. Snoke was a boring Palpatine knock-off (I mean, they literally retconned him to be his clone), and killing him off unceremoniously was the only interesting choice Johnson made that wasn’t undone by the end of the movie. And the guard fight is incredible. Aside from Darth Maul fight (which, admittedly, may be the best in the franchise), the fight scenes in the prequels have so many backflips and somersaults, overlaid with gratuitous CGI and green screen, that they felt like special effects instead of fight choreography. Fighting those 5 gaurds had more weight and higher stakes than Obi-Wan battling a CGI Grievous or jumping over green screen lava with anakin.
The fuck are you talking about? I’m not complaining about Rey being too powerful or Luke being too grumpy, I’m not bitching about Rose existing, and I’m actually defending Hodo instead of throwing a fit that a woman in a dress was in a position of authority. I’ve also got 2 paragraphs about structural issues and thematic failures that I’ve never heard anyone mention. Maybe some right-winger brought up one of the same plot holes, but anyone with half a brain would ask why they didn’t pull that light-speed maneuver against the Death Star.
Maybe I’ve never seen the “right-wing” criticism of The Last Jedi… But all the criticism I have seen is basically the same as yours (plus “wtf gravity dropping bombs out of a hole in the bottom of a space ship”).
The right wing criticism is always dumb shit about Rey being too strong.
The reality is that in TLJ, Rey was relegated to a support role. She doesn’t actually do anything except become attracted to an abusive asshole (who tried to mind rape her previously) because he looks good with his shirt off. This is what happens when you have Rian Johnson writing women. You know, the guy that did the most egregious fridging of a woman of all time in Looper? That guy made a Star Wars movie and it was the most misogynistic movie in all of Star Wars.
It was advertised as being “about strong women” so everyone pretends that’s what it is. If people actually took the movie for what it is instead of what it was advertised to be the political criticism would go the opposite way.
Seriously? There was a whole movement to reshoot the movie because the, “SJWs,” had ruined Star Wars. They claimed they, “destroyed,” Luke’s character because that wanted to, “empower,” Rey. They were furious that Poe was getting reprimanded by women, and that Hodo wore a dress. They even bullied the lady who played Rose Tico off of Instagram for being a woman of color in Star Wars.
I didn’t even like talking my problems with the movie because I didn’t want to be lumped in with the Groypers and incels. I kept seeing reviews and comments talking about how this completely turned Star Wars on it’s head and I kept thinking, “no it fucking didn’t, they chickened out and reestablished the status quo at the last second,” but I kept my mouth shut for years.
Edit: This smug little weirdo makes for a good case study of the right-wing grievance culture around the movie. Just be sure to watch with an ad blocker so you don’t give him any revenue.
Yea, I dunno, I guess I’m glad I missed all that, this is all news to me. That entire trilogy was so bad for so many reasons I guess I just kinda checked out and didn’t even realize.
I heard a bunch of right wing criticism of The Force Awakens, and it was mainly “A WOMAN AND A BLACK MAN? HOW CAN I EVEN CONCENTRATE ON THE FILM WHEN THEY’RE INSULTING ME WITH A BLACK MAN AND A WOMAN, IT’S SO FALSE AND FAKE.”
I remember seeing those for the force awakens, but I don’t recall hearing it about the second one. Not saying it didn’t happen, just wasn’t the primary criticisms I was seeing.
The Last Jedi sucks, but not for the reasons right-wing chuds complained about. The premise of the entire chase rests on a bunch of Macguffin’s (they can suddenly track ships through hyperspace, fuel is an issue for the first time ever, no one can escape except when they can), the Canto Bight sequence is pointless and contrived, the light-speed kamikaze blows a plot hole in basically every other movie, and Poe should have been executed for mutiny.
Structurally, I get what Johnson was doing; everyone complained that The Force Awakens was a beat for beat retelling of A New Hope, so he basically inverted the plot structure of The Empire Strikes Back. It’s a fun idea, but his desire to end on a Hoth sequence ruined what could have been a perfect ending. I was having problems with that movie, but after Snoke gets murdered, Rey and Ben have one of the best lightsaber fights in Star Wars history, and Ben asks her to join him, I was expecting the credits to roll, and I was ready to leave on one of the greatest cliffhangers in movie history. But then there’s another 30 minutes of movie, and while the Luke stuff is cool, it mostly just drags on.
It’s also clear that Johnson wasn’t just inverting plot structure, but Star Wars norms. Everything that is established is questioned and turned on it’s head. The problem is, by the end of the film, it’s all thrown out and the status quo is hastily reestablished with little justification. What’s the lesson from Canto Bight and DJ? “Rebellion? Empire? Two sides of the same coin for the weapons dealers. The real battle is between the haves and have-nots.” How does the movie end? “Get on the princess’ space ship, we’re not done fighting the Empire!” The entire Rey/Luke/Ben aspect of the film? “Light? Dark? Jedi? Sith? They’re just artificial constructs. Let them die. Burn the temple.” How does the movie end? “Don’t worry, Rey didn’t join the Dark Side and she’s got all the magic Jedi books!”
Anyway, there’s also a lot of stuff I like (the Rey/Luke scenes are excellent), and it’s bad in an interesting way, which makes it better than the rest of the trilogy by default. I guess this is more of a small essay than a hot take, but TL;DR: chuds think The Last Jedi sucks because of wokeness, but it actually suckes for lot of structural, thematic, and plot weaknesses.
The Last Jedi is my favourite Star Wars movie, but I respect you fir having thought-out and valid reasons fir disliking it
I mean, there is a lot of good stuff in there, and I genuinely love Rian Johnson. I think the Knives Out movies are the best thing to happen to the mystery genre in decades, and Poker Face is the second best. And honestly, most of my problems with TLJ are because of Johnson made interesting choices, which is better than Abrahams making a shot-for-shot remake of A New Hope or whatever the hell he was trying to do with Rise of Skywalker.
I think I’d be happier with the sequel trilogy if Rian Johnson had been in charge of all 3
Yeah, probably, although I think anyone with a vague idea of an overarching plot would have made me happier.
Yeah I feel like I saw a different movie than everyone else with that one. I think everyone got on their respective hills willing to die based on the marketing, and no one was willing to change their opinions.
TLJ was actually the most misogynistic of all of the Star Wars movies. It was boring and unoriginal. It fails at everything related to action and adventure. Everything that happened in it was just stuff from ESB and RoTJ thrown into a blender with the point of those plotlines removed. It didn’t change anything about Star Wars, it just removed a bunch of things set up in the previous movie and added nothing to replaced it.
Yeah after the big bad is killed, they fight some unnamed guards. That’s kinda the problem with TLJ in a nutshell, by trying to do everything backwards it removes the point of everything. Normally in an action movie they might fight some guards before facing the big bad to build up some tension. But in TLJ it’s just stuff that looks cool but there’s no point to it. There’s no tension when the main characters are fighting unnamed dudes. Who even were those guys?
Rian Johnson doesn’t understand action movies. Sure he made Looper, but that was basically the same plot as Terminator 2, except gangsters instead of robots, and had way less action. He just didn’t know how to make an action movie, but they gave him free reign on the middle movie of a trilogy.
Curious to know why you feel that way. I’ve heard chuds complain that it was too feminist, but I’ve never heard anyone claim it was misogynistic.
Yeah, I didn’t care. Snoke was a boring Palpatine knock-off (I mean, they literally retconned him to be his clone), and killing him off unceremoniously was the only interesting choice Johnson made that wasn’t undone by the end of the movie. And the guard fight is incredible. Aside from Darth Maul fight (which, admittedly, may be the best in the franchise), the fight scenes in the prequels have so many backflips and somersaults, overlaid with gratuitous CGI and green screen, that they felt like special effects instead of fight choreography. Fighting those 5 gaurds had more weight and higher stakes than Obi-Wan battling a CGI Grievous or jumping over green screen lava with anakin.
Funny how you handwave other criticisms as right wing chuds, then continue to use the same arguments they made…
Look, it was just a terrible movie, let’s leave it at that
The fuck are you talking about? I’m not complaining about Rey being too powerful or Luke being too grumpy, I’m not bitching about Rose existing, and I’m actually defending Hodo instead of throwing a fit that a woman in a dress was in a position of authority. I’ve also got 2 paragraphs about structural issues and thematic failures that I’ve never heard anyone mention. Maybe some right-winger brought up one of the same plot holes, but anyone with half a brain would ask why they didn’t pull that light-speed maneuver against the Death Star.
Maybe I’ve never seen the “right-wing” criticism of The Last Jedi… But all the criticism I have seen is basically the same as yours (plus “wtf gravity dropping bombs out of a hole in the bottom of a space ship”).
The right wing criticism is always dumb shit about Rey being too strong.
The reality is that in TLJ, Rey was relegated to a support role. She doesn’t actually do anything except become attracted to an abusive asshole (who tried to mind rape her previously) because he looks good with his shirt off. This is what happens when you have Rian Johnson writing women. You know, the guy that did the most egregious fridging of a woman of all time in Looper? That guy made a Star Wars movie and it was the most misogynistic movie in all of Star Wars.
It was advertised as being “about strong women” so everyone pretends that’s what it is. If people actually took the movie for what it is instead of what it was advertised to be the political criticism would go the opposite way.
Seriously? There was a whole movement to reshoot the movie because the, “SJWs,” had ruined Star Wars. They claimed they, “destroyed,” Luke’s character because that wanted to, “empower,” Rey. They were furious that Poe was getting reprimanded by women, and that Hodo wore a dress. They even bullied the lady who played Rose Tico off of Instagram for being a woman of color in Star Wars.
I didn’t even like talking my problems with the movie because I didn’t want to be lumped in with the Groypers and incels. I kept seeing reviews and comments talking about how this completely turned Star Wars on it’s head and I kept thinking, “no it fucking didn’t, they chickened out and reestablished the status quo at the last second,” but I kept my mouth shut for years.
Edit: This smug little weirdo makes for a good case study of the right-wing grievance culture around the movie. Just be sure to watch with an ad blocker so you don’t give him any revenue.
Yea, I dunno, I guess I’m glad I missed all that, this is all news to me. That entire trilogy was so bad for so many reasons I guess I just kinda checked out and didn’t even realize.
I heard a bunch of right wing criticism of The Force Awakens, and it was mainly “A WOMAN AND A BLACK MAN? HOW CAN I EVEN CONCENTRATE ON THE FILM WHEN THEY’RE INSULTING ME WITH A BLACK MAN AND A WOMAN, IT’S SO FALSE AND FAKE.”
So yeah, pretty racist and misogynist.
I remember seeing those for the force awakens, but I don’t recall hearing it about the second one. Not saying it didn’t happen, just wasn’t the primary criticisms I was seeing.
Yup.