Family of four, two close friends and nanny also died in crash as pilot identified as 55-year-old Jeff Gregory
Nathalia Filgueiras, 20, was co-pilot of the private Learjet 60 en route from Austin-Bergstrom international airport in Texas to North Eleuthera airport in the Bahamas on Sunday when it suddenly plummeted out of the sky, killing all onboard, her mother told the New York Times.
Later on Monday, the family of the passengers who died posted a statement on Facebook identifying the victims and paying tribute to them.
It named them as Adam Robinson, 45, a Texas-based technology entrepreneur; his wife Helen Sharp, 40; and their children, Emma, four, and Charlie, two. The statement said close family friends Rachael Reed and Charmi Fehr were also killed, along with Anita Maria Cetina, the children’s nanny.
The pilot in charge of the Learjet was identified by TMZ and other media outlets on Monday as Jeff Gregory, 55, an experienced aviator from Pennsylvania.
I feel bad for the pilots and kids and the nanny.
If I die in a planecrash, or heck, by any outlandish means at all, I really hope the internet doesn’t latch onto my death as if I was a part of some conspiracy. Especially when everyone knowledgeable says this is exactly how that event would go. Shameful.
I haven’t read about any conspiracy. Where are you getting your news?
Basically just accusing her of being a DEI hire.
Eh, as long as you’re not the 20 something woman that drives clicks, you probably won’t be the headline.
Eh, rich assholes taking risks in their own PJs dying doesn’t really make me sad. Only for the nanny and maybe the pilot if he was a salaried employee.
Two kids died.
You would care less about the pilot if he was a contractor?
Sort of feel the same, and it’s just so out of reach to own your own private jet. The most thematic aspect of this crash was how fast it happened and how it was able to be recorded from multiple angles. The rest, well, it’s just like seeing a video of a car crash, am I supposed to care more because they are rich? Their death was at least better than most people who die in accidents get, it was at least instantaneous - there are worse ways to die.
News is literally combing over every aspect of their life - what the last conversation with traffic control was, what SMS were sent just before they crashed from who to whom, who the entire entourage is … I don’t care anymore than any other random accident, and I don’t see why I should, yet it’s hard to avoid the feed. I see people empathizing with the deceased who would just dismiss or mock some other’s without the glitz death they could dismiss as a caricature if some other context was slapped onto it.
May the dead be able to be mourned by their loved ones in peace, away from those who would turn it into a spectacle.
You’re supposed to care because they are people. Despite their wealth and what you perceive as a lifestyle you don’t support, they are just people who died unfortunely and that is too bad. Newsworthy? Not unless you are in that area IMHO.
You should care because clicks increase revenue
Should probably change that name to morallyinferior 😬 let’s not forget about the children on the plane either…
You’re talking about a class of people who bombed the country I’m from with their taxes and policies they support including killing an entire school filled with children so no, sorry, I’m not feeling too bad about them
Oh I get it, your username is like those people who tell other people they’re cool. If you have to tell other people you’re cool it means you’re not. If you have to tell other people you’re morally superior…
So people who paid their taxes? Yeah, I don’t imagine you feel much.
I’m not saying you should, I’m just saying ur username is awfully hypocritical considering you’ve stooped to the level of this class of people. Hey man I get it, if you can’t beat them join them, but I’m more strong willed than that. Some of us actually have morals, and not the kind that change based on who were dealing with.
it seems that she was the one understanding the ATC advice properly and trying to get the pilot to navigate around the dangerous weather
No, it doesn’t seem like that at all. It seems like a normal distribution of labour in a cockpit and good CRM. If you don’t know anything about a subject you are allowed to keep your mouth shut and not add to all the pointless speculating around a tragedy.
I don’t interpret their comment to imply the other pilot didn’t understand, just that her role was to manage the ATC communications which… is exactly what you agree with? The other pilot’s duty wasn’t to interpret the ATC guidance but to take action.
Maybe you should keep your mouth shut and reread before yelling at people.
It was a clear implication that the other pilot didn’t understand ATC advice and wasn’t navigating around the weather. Hooked on phonics obviously didn’t work for you.
Private/business jets should be outlawed, on top of the ecological cost most crashes are small planes like this. And people will say “oh but they’re safer than cars”, but nobody needs a fucking jet to get places. The consequences of it failing are just too high.
I remember sometime back that some rich bloke was talking about cutting cost for maintenance in airliners. Part of me wants to say that somebody got the message and started cutting corners for private jets first.
They’re not safer than cars if i remember right. Small planes are a lot more dangerous statistically per hour or mile travelled. Going per hour general aviation is 24 times more lethal https://avweb.com/insider/why-we-dont-care-about-fatal-accidents/ and yeah the link is bait to get you to read.
"If the automobile fatal accident rate were equivalent to GA’s fatal rate, we would kill more than 800,000 people a year and your car insurance would cost $25,000. "
GA isn’t private jets, generally. Those jets are way safer than anything single engine.
Nobody needs X is a moot point. You also don’t need the vast majority of your possessions. Some things are simply nice to have, especially when you can afford them. There are just things that you don’t like other people having.
Also, the chance of you dying on a place crash either as a passenger or a person on the ground is astronomically small. 104 people died in a car crash yesterday in the US alone and this is true for every single day of the year.
104 people dying in a car crash yesterday says jack shit about plane safety when you haven’t normalized the data for the fact that a lot more people are driving than flying.
You’re a bit confused on the stats
The planes that have the most accidents are general aviation (GA) planes, not chartered private jets like this
GA is the actual small planes. 2-4 seaters usually. It’s also the least experiences pilots, usually pilots building hours to be in the airlines or charters
Charters follow a lot, but not all, of the same safety regulations as commercial airlines. They do still have more accidents, for a variety of reasons
Charter companies play an important role in the pilot pipeline. Many commercial pilots work at charters while they build hours to get their ATP to be able to work at a commercial airline
If they couldn’t work at a charter, they would have to instead fly in circles to build hours. A suboptmial outcome
The consequences of it failing are just too high.
Mile per mile, cars are more deadly. If the concern is safety, you’d have to start there
Cars are only deadly because any idiot and his dog can get a licence. If car drivers had to go through as much training and rigorous standards as pilots, cars would be safer, since they can’t fall out of the sky.
Mile per mile, cars are more deadly. If the concern is safety, you’d have to start there
Because our skys don’t look like this
You should take a look at ADSB data above JFK or ATL if you think that’s the case. The density of planes is incredible. Planes are landing and departing as quickly as possible
Further, heavy traffic is less fatal. Cars are moving slowly enough that most accidents are minor
I would also point out, it isn’t close. Cars are something like 20 times more dangerous per mile than commercial aviation
No. Because the aviation industry doesn’t like to make mistakes twice.
Except for Boeing, they double down and fuck up their designs even more.
Boeing began to believe shareholder value is more important than safety.
(After the McDonald Douglas merger)
Yes, that’s when things went downhill…
Well, not wrong, at least, they do it in new an innovative ways every time. Rarely do I see it the same boring catastrophic failure.
Well - aside from the repeated MCAS mass murder and followup incidents, they do seem to have had had multiple toxic smoke in cockpit incidents from bird strike. So far only luck and pilot skill prevented a catastrophic loss due to that.
Shout out all the pilots.
Meanwhile, the auto industry manages absolutely every issue as a simple cost of business. Does the cost to fix/replace/prevent an issue cost more than the lawsuit or fine? If yes, then it doesn’t get done until they’re forced to fix the issue.
So apparently the rates of crashes in general aviation are set off by drunk pilots in Alaska specifically. If you exclude alcohol-related crashes in Alaska, general aviation starts to look a lot safer.
Planes have a max gross takeoff weight that much be followed at all times, unless you’re in Alaska
Alaskan pilots kept crashing because they skipped fuel to fit in another passenger so often the FAA said it was better for them to fly overweight than with absolute minimum fuel
There are a handful of regulations with an “except in Alaska” carveout
Flying in Alaska takes time if you’re not landing shitfaced you’re doing it wrong.
Can we exclude drunk drivers from California (since it’s the biggest offender) and call cars safer then? We can’t remove inconvenient data and people don’t just drink and fly in one state.
Alaskan aviation is very different from the rest of the country
They literally are not even flying with the same rules and regulations
It’s still far safer than driving, but Alaskan aviation is not as safe as the rest of the country, and should be separated out due to the different rules
California is only the biggest offended because it has the biggest population.
If you go per hundred thousand people there are many states that rank high above California.
Aircrafts Georg is an outlier adn should not have been counted.
I love how they call them ‘business jets’ instead of millionaire transports. because honestly.
They’re almost always owned by businesses, hence the moniker
Lot of companies use them to transport executives, or companies own the planes to sell charter flights
It’s exceptionally rare for an individual to own one
As opposed to cars, which have famously few consequences when things go wrong.
As much as I’d love to see them made illegal, I don’t remember the last time I saw an SUV or oversized pickup truck make a 20 foot crater.
Tesla: hold my beer
True and fair. But, on the flip side, I don’t remember the last time I saw a private jet plow through a crowd of protestors. So, like, there are trade-offs I guess.
I think I’m getting th gist of the conversation, transportation can be dangeous. Did I sum that up well?
Depends on how much TNT you load into the car
No, private cars should be outlawed too.
Sam Altman is that you?
All airplanes are safer than all cars, per passenger mile.
Small planes are dramatically more dangerous than commercial airliners. No, this wasn’t a Cessna, but still.
Maybe they should be outlawed for environmental reasons, but private jets operated by professional service providers as in this case aren’t the “small planes” with the high crash rates. It’s the ones with piston engines and inexperienced owner-pilots that crash a lot.
Even those are roughly comparable to cars in terms of injury and death rates for a comparable trip. Driving is one of the most dangerous things the average person does, so that’s not exactly good, but it seems to be within most peoples’ risk tolerance.
The guy who chartered the flight ran this company - https://retention.com/
After reading more about his companies, RB2B and retention.com, I have to say he was a filthy scummy fuck who ran businesses that regularly exploited legal grey areas, consumer rights, and outright violate the law in many cases and jurisdictions.
I feel sorry for the fight crew, Nanny, and kids. Otherwise I only wish he would have had every executive of his scam corps in that jet with him.
Not really sure how that’s relevant to my comment, it’s still bad for planes to be falling out of the sky and killing multiple children + workers, no matter who chartered the flight.
Private jets that crash a lot kill rich assholes.
So maybe instead of banning them we lower regulations and mandate people over a certain net worth must travel by private jet.
And also they get exclusive first access to any new submersibles.
Well, that and also hand out rocket launchers to randomly-selected citizens.
Ethical, environmental, and ground safety (these jets have to fall somewhere, after all) aside, this removes the whole hubris aspect of these crashes and implosions.
At which point you might as well use guillotines.
A 2 year old and a 4 year old died in terror, no amount of billionaires would be worth it.
You must be this tall to board the private jet:
————>
Israel and Russia have murdered hundreds of thousands of kids over the past due years, if not millions. Most of them died in equal amounts of terror, if not more, and we didn’t even get one billionaire as collateral
Well, not yet. There’s still a lot of future.
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There was a scene in a show whose title I can’t recall where a man was in a bus depot talking to a young mother with her child sleeping in her lap.
She said they were taking the bus because it was a lower carbon option.
The psychopath pointed out that the best thing she could do for the climate would be to kill her child.
A child growing up in the West, let alone a privileged one, is the single longest and biggest source of carbon emissions we know of.
Edit: The show is called Utopia. The original British version.
Fuck I forgot about that scene. Here it is:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ZzdmkDwuiC4
That show was incredible
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Lol. I got moderated for that tame-ass response. Oh the civility!
Yeah I’m fine with drawing the line at child sacrifice, actually.
Bootlicker.
/s
So you’re saying palantir is edging out the competition?
Score
wonder why the AI had him killed.
<cue xfiles theme>
thoughts go out the families of the pilots and the nanny.
Kids to.
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lol
Yeah, laugh at the death of innocent people.
No matter how much you hate the rich wankers who were on board as PAX, the pilots were just working their jobs, and didn’t deserve this, and you’re a disgusting fucking pos
Also two kids and a nanny.
Even if we assume all the rich adults were assholes just because they were rich, the majority of people on that plane were not rich adults.
and very lucky people on the ground didn’t get killed.
Lemmites need to stop dissociating from society.
The video of the crash was insane. It legit crashed like it was a missle or a drone strike. I think it was intentional. I think the only malfunction that could cause that angle and steep of a dive is if the controls got stuck.
I think the only malfunction that could cause that angle and steep of a dive is if the controls got stuck
An easy opinion to have when you know absolutely nothing about aviation. Welcome to the Dunning-Kruger club
Wings iced up and stopped creating lift so the plane fell from the sky.
No mystery except why they flew so close to the storm.
You’re making quite the assumption there. We don’t know why they crashed. There are many possibilities. Icing may have diminished or removed control surface authority before a stall occurred, as an example of an alternate option
You have split a hair that laymen would not bother to percieve.
Do you have an agenda?
To expand on this a little: long before a wing stops working from ice, it becomes a different wing with different aerodynamic characteristics, like stall angle and critical mach number. This is of course just speculation at this point, but among informed professionals I’ve heard a lot of talk about a mach tuck, which is probably not recoverable, even without the possible loss of the horizontal stabilizer.
This wasn’t remotely the first crash where an aircraft hit the ground at similar angles and descent rates, you’re talking out of your ass about something you clearly have zero knowledge in
I don’t know man I still don’t think Epstein killed himself.
dude, the horizontal stabilizer was ripped off. they flat out said on the radio they exceeded speed thresholds of the aircraft. the plane got caught in a thunderstorm, got damaged, and lost control.
the plane got caught in a thunderstorm, got damaged, and lost control.
We don’t have enough information yet for this assumption. It could either be the damage caused loss of control, or the loss of control caused the damage
The pilots reported icing shortly before the loss of control, which can absolutely cause uncontrolled descents. Overspeed can cause the loss of horizonstal stabs
I haven’t seen any proof the stabilizer ripped off. The video is too blurry to be definitive. But the control surfaces were at least frozen
there are pictures of it everywhere. still frames from the videos.
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Lear jets have a T-tail. It’s not hiding under the engines or anything, it would be plainly visible if it were there.
Great. Who cares? You’re not a family member or friend of the victims. You’re not an investigator with the FAA or the NTSB. You can believe whatever you want to believe.
Um ok? Why the fuck are you so aggressive about it? Are you an NTSB investigator or just a guy declaring facts because you saw pics on the internet? Hypocritical asshole
I think it was intentional
To what end? It crashed into a sidewalk, harming no one else. There are way easier ways to off yourself than a jet hitting the ground at 30000 fpm.
I’ve had enough of this thread. I hit the stupid threshold fast.
Tragic all around, their poor families. When they say planes are safe, they mean the big ones.
Learjets are many times safer than cars, mile-per-mile
Didn’t the plane fall straight on top of a car? No victims on the ground?
person in a car had their leg injured. surprisingly thats it.
road got hurt.
As dark as this situation is I did laugh a bit when the following day I saw a new headline stating there were no survivors.
Like… no kidding?
The car was over to the left of this image. Still a very close call to a lot of energy hitting the ground.
It hit right off the side of the road.
I don’t know if it did. But if so, they were probably poor and/or ugly so no news outlet cares. This article shows a sexy pilot as the main victim, because that sells. It’s disgusting.
There are a lot of reasons this case gained so much media attention. The FO’s looks are not one of them
The ATC audio, video footage, and dramatic nature of the accident are
Victim? It was an accident…that’s a hell of a word to use.
You can be a victim of an accident.
Victims of an accident??
Victim of success
Why is she always called the co-pilot? It sounds like she made all the decisions/communications at the end.
Where’s the pilot if she’s such a child?
She was handling duties that she could to the pilot could focus on reading the relevant gauges and taking action. Her job was to manage comms, which is why you hear her on the tape.
The pilot was flying the plane. They were both doing their jobs.
Because cockpits have ranks, there is generally a captain and a first officer, but even in a dual captain cockpit, there is ALWAYS a pilot in command (colloquialy pilot, always a CPT) and a pilot (colloquial co-pilot, usually an FO). She was not the pilot in command on this flight, and therefore, in colloquial terminology the co pilot.
These roles are also completely independent from the duties of “pilot flying” (at the controls) and “pilot monitoring” (in charge of communication and instrument monitoring).
I think people just talk about her bc young pretty girl. We should honestly probably just let ai fly planes in the future.
If only there was some kind of news article that could answer these questions.
It’s exactly what the co-pilot does. Communicating with the ATC, reading instruments and any relevant checklist to the pilot. During an emergency like this, the pilot’s primary job is keep both hands on the stick and do everything in their power to get the plane under control and either land safely or return to a safe altitude until they can land. The co-pilot is the one who takes a step back from controls and gets all relevant information to the pilot and ATC in the tower.
If you’ve ever watched the movie Sully, it’s a decent example where the senior/veteran pilot is attempting what he can with the controls that are responding while the co-pilot goes through the emergency checklist and attempts to restart the engines.
Generally co-pilot refers to the pilot not in command, as opposed to the pilot in command (pic), the roles of pilot flying and pilot monitoring usually change from flight to flight even if the same flight crew sticks together, and occasionally even during a single flight (especially during emergencies, since almost all airlines require the PIC to become the pilot flying, if not already, during an emergency).
Pilot in command never changes during a flight, so co-pilot generally refers to that role split, as opposed to whatever the duties of monitoring and flying happen to be at a given time.
Pilot in command never changes during a flight
What if they die or parachute out. What if the plane splits in two with the PIC in one half. Can the other half nominate a new PIC.
It does change. I’ve done it plenty of times. Just not normal to change roles en route as a working professional
There’s some subtlety about Sully’s case here. He was captain and pilot monitoring during the takeoff while the first officer was pilot flying.
After the engines failed, Sully used his authority as captain to take over flying.
Pilot Flying is flying the plane. Pilot Monitoring handles the radio and monitors/adjusts systems. The two pilots generally trade off who handles what each flight, but they can also swap during a flight if needed.
She was Pilot Monitoring, which is sometimes called co-pilot. Her job was to handle everything else during the emergency while the Pilot Flying tried to regain control.
The other important distinction is captain and first officer, with the latter often being described as “co-pilot”. The captain has final authority and primary legal responsibility for the flight regardless of who is operating which controls at any given time.
I had a whole paragraph about that distinction, but I deleted it to not confuse things further. Co-pilot can refer to the supporting pilot or the junior pilot. In this case, she appeared to be both.
The real point was that during an upset, the pilot at the controls doesn’t have time to talk to the outside world or really do anything besides try to recover.
I think that in these types of small planes, the more experienced pilot does the actual flying and the less experienced one is monitoring everything, including all the communications. So the main pilot was busy trying to figure out if there was any way to get out of the trouble they were in.
That’s not really true the pilots will trade off on legs each one swapping roles so the copilot can become equally proficient in the airplane and move up to captain.
The more experienced pilot still has the role of teacher however.
