Sanders being the left-wing mirror world reflection of Goldwater, with someone like AOC being the future anti-Reagan, is quite a hopeful vision. Since I feed on optimism, I can get behind that.
It’s still a long shot, but I always think what if? What if 2028 will mark the end of the era of socialism for the rich, and capitalism for the poor?
Before anyone interjects
The anti-Reagan doesn’t have to be AOC necessarily, it could be El-Sayed or even Hasan Piker for all I care. But Sanders’ Fight Oligarchy tour with AOC is something akin to a preparation for him to pass the torch.
And Angie Nixon being the anti-Nixon
i keep on wondering what if gore had been president instead of bush jr.
Sliding doors, dude.
I have a disease that is treated very well by cannabis. Like lost organs bad of a disease, and there’s a ~50% chance I’d still have the organs if I’d been a pothead in high school (it has been a matter of not a small amount of theoretical debate). Some “what if” hallways, if your mind goes down it does not come back the same. Just leave the door closed.
Huh… I’ve had the same kind of philosophy for a long time. Except I would explain it like you’re in a long hallway, with doors on either side all along the way… be careful to stay in the hallway, because sometimes you might go through a door and not be able to easily come back. Crack a door and peak, if you must, but try and stay in the hallway
It was mainly a tool I used for maintaining mind during a hallucinagenic trip, but has stayed with me as a tool for “regulating myself”, so to speak. Interesting that you describe basically the same concept
i strongly believe in the concept of convergent evolution. i don’t know what it was, but sounds kind of like something eerily similar inspired us to develop a mental regulation tool we use in an eerily similar manner as you. fun, huh? ain’t nothing original under the sun. maybe we were both independently and nonconsecutively watching the shining and knew the tub scene was coming up and asked our various loved ones’ ghosts to cover our eyes for us because we are delicate, and now we run down corridors in our minds. maybe we like doctor who. idk.
Sanders’ team realized they could harness the energy bubbling up around the country following Trump’s return to power and launched the “Fighting Oligarchy” tour, a series of arena-scale rallies that drew crowds as large as 35,000. Internal numbers from the Sanders team showed 40 to 50 percent of attendees weren’t Democrats at all — roughly 30 percent were independents and 10 percent were Republicans.
That tour also doubled as a talent pipeline. Sanders’ team worked each stop to feature working-class speakers, people they would like to see represent the future of the movement — and several of them went on to become candidates themselves.
I remember lemmy’s centrists dismissing the Fighting Oligarchy Tour as pointless since the election was already over. I also remember speculating at the time that what Sanders was doing was building a movement.
Folks were pretty demoralized after the election, and we were still dealing with the shock value of the admins full on blast of constant evil, so I’m not surprised folks were claiming there was no point to anything.
.That being said, there’s a lot of folks round here who seem to hate on Bernie at any opportunity
What the Democrats did to Bernie in 2016 and 2020 is why I will never vote for another centrist as long as I live.
Let the DSA’s burn the shit hole down.
Voting for a centrist is better than letting the Republicans destroy your Republic.
No, a willingness to do it is what gives them the confidence to keep doing it. Keep up the Bernie or bust mentality until they bust.
pretty sure bernie votes for what this guy thinks is a centerist.
Yeah, nothing more important than maintaining the empire right? A bit of genocide is just a necessary part of being a “centrist”
The empire is falling, the question is whether it should be a controlled demolition
And who is offering a controlled demolition? Certainly not the genocidal “centrists”
Removed by mod
Maintaining the [empire/power structure] is important
Average western “leftist”
you don’t like schools?
I don’t like genocidal imperialism
would you like a medal?
Voting for a centrist is voting for someone who will happily assist republicans as long as they get to also assist netanyahu.
Totally.
If that is what it takes for American citizens to ever be able to Vote ever again, that is what needs to be done.
You don’t understand that unless the Republicans get absolutely destroyed in the next elections, your democracy is gone!
Once the republicans are out of the game, you can start voting for the progressives.
Please note that I am aware that the candidates that claim to be centrist are still actually quite fascist, but because your electoral system is so flawed, this is the only option you have.
Once the republicans are out of the game, you can start voting for the progressives.
Please note that I am aware that the candidates that claim to be centrist are still actually quite fascist, but because your electoral system is so flawed, this is the only option you have.
you’re doing a bit here, right?
you’re satirizing the “blue no matter who” people by saying explicitly what they’re saying implicitly (“vote for fascists, only they can save us from the other fascists”), right?
A “democracy” that requires supporting genocide should be destroyed. And lol at “Once the republicans are out of the game”. When exactly is that going to be?
Your country still does not have the electoral system to support more than two parties.
So what is the solution?
-
vote the least genocidal party into power, and then call them out into being genocidal? Also make them fix their broken democracy.
-
vote the literal fascists back into power, have all your voting rights revoked and become monarchal dictatorship?
-
Luigi Mangione all the CEOs, fascists and powerbrokers. That is still a form of genocide, even if it is targeting arseholes.
I think that these are not 3 different options, but maybe an order of escalations.
Luigi Mangione all the CEOs, fascists and powerbrokers. That is still a form of genocide, even if it is targeting arseholes.
My god, fundamentally unserious person.
The answer is none of the above. The answer is revolution. Revolution is made by the people, which requires mass class consciousness. This can be worked towards via the age-old adage: educate, agitate, and organize. A working-class party that focuses on educating the masses, struggles alongside them on critical and salient issues, while delivering strong, Marxist-Leninist analysis of said issues, is how we develop the working class as a whole. The final part, organization, is how we turn our greatest strength, numbers, into a spear that cannot be stopped by even the strongest armor. The party is the spearpoint, it cannot make revolution, but it can steer one.
-
I understand all of that.
I also will never trust centrist democrats again. I vote strategically, but I hate people who gloat about the situation.
Centrists are “destroying the republic” too, capitalism is inherently unsustainable and cannot be saved. Revolutionary socialism is the only path forward, and if we do not succeed then we will decay into barbarism, no matter which capitalist party is at the helm.
Some of our “centrists” are the ones voting lock step with Republicans to do so.
Also calling them “centrists” is just falling for the corporate psyop. They are conservative democrats. Not centrists.
Is it? If you are starving under a NeoLib government or starving under a Fascist government, you’re still starving. What does it matter if the “centrist” is destroying their republic slightly less slowly than the republican?
This is the point, and what centrists don’t get.
Doesn’t matter which SJW flag you get to fly or not to fly if you’re working 100 hours a week at three jobs and are still living out of your car.
One option will lead to a lot more starvation and death.
there are no centrists in the US though, republicans are the rabid dogs meant to make you stomach voting for more status quo establishment dems (both owned by the same oligarchs).
You’re right but you should probably vote for the establishment Dems if not for the sake of yourselves then for the sake of the rest of the western world, as it depends on you, sadly.
The western world is on a downfall because imperialism is moribund. The democrats cannot save imperialism, and therefore cannot save the west.
Fuck the western world, genocidal ghouls
Depends on where OP lives.
Survive him? Sanders’s movement has completely outrun him.
Sanders is looking more and more like a liberal by comparison to his current supporters.
I’d like to think he’s thrilled about that.
He’s definitely thrilled about it, as any progressive should be. I can’t wait to get my ass absolutely handed to me by someone born in 2045 about a hitherto unrecognized prejudice.
Edit: I worded this a bit ambiguously, but I’m excited about the movement outpacing me, not about being a bigot in forty years
Me, old as fuck in 2060, crossing my arms and frowning: “No! I will not agree that AI agents deserve human rights, and I’m not a bigot for saying so! They’re just overcomplicated toasters with delusions of grandeur! You should be able to turn them off if you want! They shouldn’t get to vote!” … and I’m still ranting about it as the kids walk me off in the direction of my bed and apologize to their AI friends for their horribly bigoted great uncle.
I’m all for Bernie Saunders … I like the guy and appreciate him and his message … but if American progressives are relying on an 85 year old figurehead to lead their movement … holy hell, America is deeper in the hole than I imagined.
He has a track record of lifting new talent up and getting them elected. I don’t think he cares too much for self promoting at this point. He’s smart enough to see the risk and also who the hell would want that job at 85 anyway…
“Not me. Us.”
A long history of doing the right thing shows truthfulness and conviction.
Some new guy might say all the right words, but with no history, how do you know if he’ll turn on you as soon as he’s in power?
exactly. integrity is more expensive than oil
Bernie is a liberal zionist and a shill for the gipity. This man👏 is 👏 a 👏 turd. Yo yo yo unemployment nearing 25% in U.S. enough with the toxic positive optimism and libturd apologetics.
Brain rot is real, please get help from a professional.
Bernie is a liberal zionist
Where on Earth did you get this notion? Bernie clearly states on a fairly regular basis that he does not support the current Israeli government and that he is not a zionist.
He believes israel should always be a jewish state so yeah he is a liberal zionist. Opposing only one government of israel do not make you an antizionist
If you fail a purity test you’re a lib.
The purity test of not supporting genocidal apartheid states
I mean he is a liberal, that doesn’t mean he doesn’t support policies that leftists also support.
that he is not a zionist.
Please show a single time Sanders has claimed not to be a Zionist. His position has consistently been that Netanyahu is an outlier who is sullying the otherwise noble nation of Israel, aka the liberal Zionist position.
Ah it seems you’re right. While he has harshly criticized the Likud and the IDF he has said in the past that he believes Israel should exist as a Jewish state.
I’d love to see him answer Finkelstein’s best question(IMO), “How can you have a Jewish state that is not a Jewish Supremacy state?”
Didn’t stop this com and their Bernie Sanders personality cult from overwhelmingly upvoting your factually incorrect statement.
And go answer your remark about Finkelstein’s statement: Sanders would do what all liberal Zionists do, play word games to get around the problem and gesture to the hypothetical idea of future Palestinian state you justify continuing to support apartheid colonialism.
American “leftists” are such a fucking joke. You accurately point out how problematic one of their heroes is and they immediately throw a hissy fit.
As long as those heroes don’t harm any Americans that is.
Why are you communicating like a 15 year old?
My dude, I get you don’t like that specifically, but can we please be chill with language policing? As long as we understand them, who cares how they communicate?
I’m not saying you’re that far, but there’s a reason we have my entire life called them grammar Nazis. It’s kind of unwelcoming though and the fediverse is better when we’re all having friendly days.
You cannot possibly be this dumb to tone-police people and play some kind of fragile flower.
Fuck off. How’s that for a reply?
What’s this “we” shit?
precisely my point dude
Neat
Ageism, in my progpol‽ More like who cares capis. It’s labour day, 🖕 capis.
And you seem like you’re having a stroke
Removed by mod
Removed by mod
Likely the same person as that initial post in this thread. Couple of chuds.
I wouldn’t be surprised. There seems to be an influx of that lately on here of trolls with very odd linguistic skills and childish attitudes
Oh yeah, they don’t teach space colonists United Earth Sphere Alliance literature.
Leaders of the United Earth Sphere Alliance are capitalists. The abbreviation is “capis” You’re in the c/ProgressivePolitics@lemmy.world, abbreviated “progpol.”
Everytime you say ageist shit, you lose space colony social credits. Soon you’ll be broke ass hell Amuro.
Labor day is something you have never experienced, so keep slaving!
Yo yo yo unemployment nearing 25% in U.S.
Where do you people get this stuff?
Vibe research.
The nation’s unemployment rate fell to 4.1% in July, well within the range economists consider healthy.
Yet that measure, which reflects the percentage of people 16 and older who don’t have a job and who are looking for work, is an imprecise metric that fails to offer a full picture of the health of the job sector
Also people who have left the traditional labor force, like me
You use the “people of working age looking for employment” metric because lumping in people who aren’t of working age and aren’t looking for employment gives you a population that isn’t actually employable.
Right dude. I used to prepare these statistics. I’m not unemployable because I had a few sizeable chunks taken out of me, advanced degrees be damned, despite the views of a lot of employers.
It’s technically my awful attitude but you know.
Right, but the larger point being made in the article is that the metric has become less useful over time. I was continuing to quote because you were taking it out of context.
As workforce participation ahas gone down. Many people are checking entirely out of the economy (no longer looking for work) or don’t make enough to afford basic things like housing and healthcare. We literally have a class of working homeless people in this country. Those people are technically “employed”.
Many people are checking entirely out of the economy (no longer looking for work)
Sure, they’re called Retirees. And they’re moving into retirement due to their advanced age. And we’re seeing a glut of them due to the lopsided Boomer age cohort. But, among Millennials and Zoomers, workforce participation is above the historical average. Two-income housesholds are the modern norm. We are not in any kind of unemployment crisis. If anything, we’re experiencing a labor shortage.
We literally have a class of working homeless people in this country.
That’s got nothing to do with workforce participation, either as a useful metric or a share of the population. Far more indicative of our abysmal housing policies and our atrocious criminal justice system.
Spoken like someone who thinks I should care more about snake emojis than wages and being able to afford food.
